Assistance dragged out until out of 28 day cooling off period - appreciate any advice

[Anonymous]

Hi,

First time on this forum so I hope this in the right section.

I have an HTC One on O2 contract and I'm having problems with it so would appreciate any advice on what my options are or maybe options to deal with it (beyond a call centre manager which is as far as I have got).

I have had the phone just over 2 months now and it has had issues since day one, the latest being the discovery and confirmation that the microphone isn't working properly and hasn't been since day one (it keeps dropping out on voice calls so the receiver can't hear me).

After reporting several different problems to O2 it would appear that the 'support' has been deliberately dragged out until I am now outside of the 28 day cooling off period and I have to accept a repair or a replacement (i.e. Repaired second hand unit) for the remaining 22 months of my contract (unless I buy myself out) which I find preposterous and totally unfair.

I have had to reset, full reset, try the phone in different areas, try different services in different areas and lastly try the same tests with a second new sim card (after receiving it via post) which has all taken me beyond the 28 days.

I mentioned several times that trying these 'tests' was using up time but was told that the initial date was noted and I would be OK.

Other issues have been to do with not being able to get a 3G signal and this was blamed on the sim but that has now been proven incorrect.

Now the microphone issue has been proved definately faulty and in need of repair I am hitting a brick wall with my requests for a replacement handset.

My issue with a repaired phone is that I didn't enter a contract for a 'repaired' one, I entered a contract for a brand new one, in full working order.

If I was happy to accept a repaired one I could have bought one far cheaper without a 2 year contract attached for example.

I have spoken to HTC who have advised me that the unit is faulty and furthermore it's a known fault which O2 are well aware of and they should replace it but O2 simply refuse to. They even denied any knowledge despite me offering to send them a link to their own forum where it is discussed with their own employees.

I am amazed that this is even legal, not to mention being totally unethical.

I understand that my options are very limited now due to the delays but hopefully someone here can help me find a resolution.

What I would like is a new replacement handset, otherwise I'd like the contract cancelled and fully refunded. In any other purchase & warranty situation that would be the options available to me.

Thank you.

How can O2 feel justified in arguing that a phone where the recipient can't hear the caller is 'fit for purpose'??? It beggars belief.

[MI5]

I can't answer what the warranty period would be as it's just too confusing to work out (and doesn't seem to cover this type of situation), but, as I said previously, I'd have no worries about taking a refurbished phone. All mine have been faultless and lasted as long as any other.
Also worth noting that some of the HTC One mic issues are due to people putting their finger over the mic (It gets blocked if you hook your little finger under the phone if holding in your left hand), I'm not suggesting all were that issue but many of them were not faulty at all.......

[Anonymous]

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@MI5 wrote:
Also worth noting that some of the HTC One mic issues are due to people putting their finger over the mic (It gets blocked if you hook your little finger under the phone if holding in your left hand), I'm not suggesting all were that issue but many of them were not faulty at all.......

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Sorry MI5, where did you see that?

From what I read they are almost all due to a faulty mic. and the phones were replaced.

Interestingly too, some comments say that it's the black ones that predominantly have this issue and mine is black but surely that's just a case, the internals would be the same I would have thought???

[MI5]

Colour won't make any difference - too many urban myths on the 'tinternet
You'll find many companies will replace phones that customers feel they have an issue with as it's good PR - Doesn't mean they were faulty.
I repair phones and have friends that work for a major phone repair company so the info is personal knowledge based....

[Anonymous]

Never easy is it!:

I rang HTC (‎0845 890 0079‎) and they have organised to collect the phone and repair it but when they emailed through the collection details I noticed the words "qualified HTC service partner" on the UPS ticket.

A quick search of this forum reveals that the Company is Regenersis and they are not very highly regarded. The problem is, neither are O2s repair centre.

Do you think I shoud leave it with them or cancel and take it to an O2 shop?

[MI5]

I'd stay with HTC's approved repairers....

[Anonymous]

In my opinion, O2 haven't done anything wrong here.

They are entitled to want to do fault diagnosis to get to the bottom of whats going on, in case its a simple issue that can be resolved.  Now there are usually 3-4 steps involved (settings, software, reset, hard reset) before they will look at it being a hardware fault. 

Is is completely O2's fault that this took more than the 7-day cooling off period or the 14-day period in which they will replace a phone brand new?  Presume there were gaps in time where the OP was left to carry out some instructions - could it be that the OP took a while to do some of the stuff, and is that really all O2's fault? 

The OP should also bear in mind that he choseto follow O2's advice and let them do fault diagnosis.  He could have (as is his right) demanded cancellation under the cooling off period.   After that time, he would then be obliged to follow O2's instruction.

So, after the fault testing was completed, O2 then offered repair or a replacement.  Which is what the manufacturer offered, which is also what the Sale Of Goods Act recommends.  The OP's beef with O2 is that they're offering a refurb rather than a brand new handset. 

Does the Sale Of Goods Act demand that retaillers offer a brand new item?  Does the manufacturer's own warranty do so?  If no, then why does the OP think that O2 are obliged to?  They're just administering the warranty by virtue of being the retailler.  They don't seem to be breaching the manufacturer's warranty nor breaching the Sale Of Goods Act.

So why is the OP holding them to a higher standard than the manufacturer or consumer law?

[Anonymous]

Yes is is completely O2s fault because, unlike people like you apparently, I tried to be reasonable and give people a chance, whoever they are.

O2 have taken that opportunity I fairly gave them, even though I was under no obligation to, and now seek to penalise me by the fact that I will not get the 'perfect' phone that was advertised.

You contradict yourself, first you say "they are entitled to want to do fault diagnosis" and then contradict that by saying "he chose to follow O2s advice". So is your opinion that they are entitled to expect me to do it or not then?

"Does the SOGA demand that retailers offer a brand new item?"

You completely miss the point, it's not about who demands what, it's about treating each other fairly and giving each party ample opportunity to rectify the situation at minimal cost.

I gave O2 ample opportunity, plenty of my own time, now the phone has been identified as faulty from manufacture which effectively means that in reality it should not have passed QC or left the factory.

Now that I have spent my time and afforded them the opportunity to identify that then they should put me in the position I should have been in from the start i.e. with a properly functioning phone.

It's not always about sticking strictly to "the law", sometimes basic common sense should prevail.

[Anonymous]

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@Anonymous wrote:

Yes is is completely O2s fault because, unlike people like you apparently, I tried to be reasonable and give people a chance, whoever they are.

O2 have taken that opportunity I fairly gave them, even though I was under no obligation to, and now seek to penalise me by the fact that I will not get the 'perfect' phone that was advertised.

You contradict yourself, first you say "they are entitled to want to do fault diagnosis" and then contradict that by saying "he chose to follow O2s advice". So is your opinion that they are entitled to expect me to do it or not then?

"Does the SOGA demand that retailers offer a brand new item?"

You completely miss the point, it's not about who demands what, it's about treating each other fairly and giving each party ample opportunity to rectify the situation at minimal cost.

I gave O2 ample opportunity, plenty of my own time, now the phone has been identified as faulty from manufacture which effectively means that in reality it should not have passed QC or left the factory.

Now that I have spent my time and afforded them the opportunity to identify that then they should put me in the position I should have been in from the start i.e. with a properly functioning phone.

It's not always about sticking strictly to "the law", sometimes basic common sense should prevail.

Your opinion is that you are entitled to expect more from O2 than your statuatory rights, consumer law guidelines, and normal business practises.  Do you genuinely believe that O2 have treated you in a different way from any other customer, or that any of the other networks would not have dealt with you in the same way? 

As for contradicting myself, I didn't.  I stated my opinion that O2 are entitled to want you to do fault diagnosis, but that you had a choice when you were within the first 7 days.  You could have refused, and exercised your right to cancel.  You chose not to.

As for your last part, its you that is missing the point.  O2 don't have to replace the phone with a brand new one.  The manufacturers guidelines don't force O2 to replace it with a new one, and neither does SOGA.  The fact that even knowing this, you still expect them to, shows that you are out of touch with modern business practices and the way that retaillers work. 

For O2 to replace the phone with another brand new one, when they didn't have to, means one thing.  The cost for it comes out of O2's own pocket.  And they're never going to pay for something they don't have to.

Your expectations are unrealistic I'm afraid.  By the way, you still didn't comment on why the fault diagnosis took more than 7/14 days.  Did you do everything as soon as possible and got back to O2 immediately, or did you delay in any way?  Makes a bearing on whether O2 actually did drag things out or not.  If they were waiting to you to get back to them, and you took your time in doing so, then that's not their fault.

[Anonymous]

I can't believe that I have to explain this to you again:

YES the current position that I find myself in IS O2s fault.

NO, I do not expect more than I am entitled to. Inder SOGA I was entitled to a full refund or replacement NEW phone.

I was however asked by O2 to try several things before taking a refund. Some of which took time to complete and moved me beyond the relevant timeframe. I was assured that this wouldn't be a problem as the initial date was logged. Now that isn't being honoured.

YES it was my choice, I chose to be fair and reasonable and to try to cooperate in order to help O2 save on any unavoidable costs.

The only reason O2 don't 'have to' replace it now is because I allowed them to take me beyond the window.

Yes that was my choice.

Yes they can do a u-turn and reneg on their word.

No that is not fair or reasonable.

I know the legal position I have found myself in, that's why I came on here and that's why Toby tried to help resolve it.

[Anonymous]

It is untrue that SOGA entitles you to a brand new item when replacing your phone.  It entitles you to a replacement, but doesn't stipulate that it needs to be brand new.  If it did, O2 would never offer anyone a refurbished item.  Therefore, O2 are not in the wrong by offering you a refurbished item. 

You're looking at the situation on ethical/moralistic slant.  SOGA, manufacturer's warranty and O2's business practices are based on applicable laws and rules.

Lets put it another way.  You think O2 are treating you unfairly, the manufacturer would not act differently.  They would replace the phone with a refurbished item too.  Why not contact the other networks and see what their processes would be.  You'd probably be surprised to learn that they would do the same thing too. 

You're really not being singled out unfairly here, as much as you'd like to think you are.  Last I will say on the subject, good luck in your crusade for a brand new handset.