Latest Trump Administration Madness

[Glory1]

I read this on the news this morning with total mouth dropped open amazement.

The Trump administration wants to vet certain visitors' social media history going back 5 years when applying for a visa to visit the US. It's believed this could affect over 14 million visitors.

There are no specifics as to which countries would be affected if made into law.

So they would be looking into your Twitter and Facebook accounts checking what you've posted on line under however many user names you've used over the past 5 years. And they would, of course, decide what they considered anti-US sentiment or extremist views.

As I said no countries were specified though quoting a figure of over 14 million affected would seem to cover quite a few.

And where Trump's administration would be getting the staff to do this vetting, as I doubt they have sufficient staff to cover such a mammoth task, they don't state.

Can you imagine someone sitting and going through 5 years' of Twitter and Facebook tweets and posts? Many people live in their Twitter and/or Facebook accounts and don't move without posting. Besides being probably the most boring job in the world, who exactly is going to do it?

This could just be Trump 'pie in the sky' nonsense or, if it becomes a reality, a real threat to privacy.

[Bambino]

This is yet just another Nazi tactic dreamt up by the current bonehead administration. It's an invasion of a person's civil liberties and their right to free speech. There's also the minor matter of the mid-term elections in November, which could see the Republicans lose control, and as a result of that, a very strong possibility that Trump will be impeached, or he will be prosecuted for obstruction of justice by Mueller. This is put out there as a distraction from the real issues. It wouldn't affect any UK citizens anyway, as visas are not required to enter the US.

[sheepdog]

I think the US administration would have implemented this regardless of who is in power. US government is rather xenophobic in my opinion and the laws they introduced over the years only confirms it. Its the special advisors that want this who are influenced by lobbyists who in turn are paid by the big corporates who really want this as they'll profiit in some way.

As for searching through historical posts, it can be done rather quickly with cloud computing and with AI coming into the mainstream, you won't need much manpower to process a user. Whether government can actually get a successful IT project like this implemented without over-run and losing loads of amount of money is another question. (Answer: the big consultancies will  make sure they extract as much profit out it and still fail to deliver)

Not quite a common thing yet, but there are companies (or employ companies) who are actively researching prospective employees by literally googling for them. Companies don't need to tell anyone either about it as wait for it: its publicly available information! Don't forget that what everyone usually misses in these discussions about privacy is that the likes of Facebook/Linkedin/Twitter provide API's which makes this all so easy to exploit (which is what Cambridge Analytica actually did). There's no control on that access so anybody can be a 'developer' and join the dots.

A recent contract change (and we all had to do training on it by my company) specifically mentions social media and whilst they sort of encourage promoting the company, you can't actually mention certain things that may track back to clients or technologies used! Yeah right, like I'm going to give free promotion on my personal account anyway....

[sheepdog]

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@Bambinowrote:

This is yet just another Nazi tactic dreamt up by the current bonehead administration. It's an invasion of a person's civil liberties and their right to free speech. There's also the minor matter of the mid-term elections in November, which could see the Republicans lose control, and as a result of that, a very strong possibility that Trump will be impeached, or he will be prosecuted for obstruction of justice by Mueller. This is put out there as a distraction from the real issues. It wouldn't affect any UK citizens anyway, as visas are not required to enter the US.

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Actually you do need to have an ESTA which is really notifiying them you're coming: https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/usa/entry-requirements

And of course, you pay for that...(same goes for Canada)

[Cleoriff]

They must have changed the rules on the Visa Waiver Programme then @sheepdog

I have travelled to Florida, USA, 5 times (the last was 10 years ago).

Each time we were given the VWP form to complete on the plane en-route.

Now, whether the 'cost' of that was included in the flight I have no idea, it certainly didn't require us making a separate payment to anyone else..

[Bambino]

Even if you do have to fill out an ESTA, it can all be done online, and costs the staggering amount of $14, which is roughly £10, and must be an administrative charge. Certainly easier than having to go through the visa process, and not a sum of money that would break anyone's bank account.

[Glory1]

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@Anonymouswrote:

@Cleoriff If the only drawback is an extra delay when I go on my jollies then I’m not going to say no, the security of a country is far more important than me sunning myself for a few weeks!

But I’m thinking that’s not how it will work.. social media is monitored by the CIA, FBI & other security agencies.. so if you’re flagged up and security pull you aside.. then it’s just another check, like we already have at customs..

@Glory1 Read HERE a prime example of how social media monitoring can be used. Rightly or wrongly in this case.. you decide!! Just because you thought something a few years ago doesn’t mean you think it now, but if I saw posts about Islamaphobia / terrorism /nazi / sympathisers etc in someone’s past then I’m sure we shouldn’t be employing them in a security / diplomatic role. Oh and for certain security type jobs you are asked about your online habits and background checks are carried out.

Like you, I worry about big brother watching us. If I stick stuff out on the net for the world to peruse then I’d like to think the security services aren’t wasting an opportunity to monitor me and work out that I’m not a threat and therefore discount me from further enquiries. But if they want to delve into what I don’t put out there freely, then I’d like to think that they’d need a search warrant, currently they don’t need one for mobiles, read HERE

I also worry about the use of the phrase ‘if you aren’t doing wrong then you’ve nothing to worry about’ for the reasons stated above. I don’t want them trawling through my private emails, texts, data use unless there’s a good reason to. 

But for those who wish to live their lives in full view of the world fine. As long as they're not hatching a terrorist plot to blow us all to kingdom come or organising a drugs haul/major heist exactly whose business is it.

this part of your post worries me.. people who hatch terrorist plots don’t tend to do it in view of the world. They hide it.. which is why I think these checks are another way to gain an advantage over the criminals of this world!

It's simple I mind my business and you mind yours.

And this .. that’s fine if you’re a fine upstanding citizen (which I’m sure you are) but I don’t know you from Adam or what goes off behind your closed doors 😂 

Criminals use the information to kill us / steal from us and we’re furious it was allowed to happen, but when the security services want to use it to protect us... we’re up in arms.. 

I wouldn’t like to be the one who has to make the rules on this one.. tough calls to be made on all sides of the argument!

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@Anonymous I read the articles you kindly included in your post. My thoughts are:

Paris Brown is young and stupid. I've no idea if she is racist or homophobic but her posts at 13/14 perceived her to be. Which is why it's so important to monitor what you post. If you hold anti-social views and put them on social media you deserve what you get, particularly when working for the Government, local (as in this case) or national. We've all read stories of MPs being thrown out of the party or some form of censure when posting inappropriately. And yes if applying for a diplomatic post, perhaps your on line history should be reviewed. But a blanket any employer can delve into your on line history for whatever position you're applying for, NO. Believe me racists and homophobes, to give 2 examples, don't hide their true colours. Eventually they say or do something that brings out their true nature. Been there seen that. 

Terrorists/Criminals. No they don't hatch their plots openly but use codes on line. The police and the security services know who these people are, in the majority of cases, and monitor who they speak to and where in the world they are making contact. As I've said I've no objection to this as long as there is an oversight body of some description to monitor the police and security services to ensure they don't overstep their bounds.

As for 'it's simple I mind my business you mind yours'. For what it's worth I'm not planning to bomb anywhere or steal/sell drugs or plan any illegal jobs. Nor do I hold any anti-social views. I'm not racist, homophobic or Islamaphobic. I believe in a live and let live world. However, if I did hold such views I wouldn't be stupid enough to post them on FB or tweet such thoughts on Twitter. I'd keep them between me and my closest, trusted friends. You just don't know who could be accessing your online history. It's not just the police and security forces that have that capability.

Because my life is not an open book on social media I'm less likely to be investigated by police/security forces or targeted by thieves who want my money or my identity. That's not to say I can't be robbed. I have been and before social media was the all encroaching monster it is today.

[Anonymous]

It's probably a good idea to watch what you post on social media as breach of civil liberties or not, a number of people I know who work in HR departments tell me they tend to look at a person's social media accounts to get an idea of what their character is like and take this into account when hiring.

I don't do social media as one month on facebook back in 2007 taught me there were better things to do with my time....

[Glory1]

@Anonymous I couldn't agree more. I have FB purely to save my games data. In the short time I've been on FB I've received 100s of friend requests from people I don't know; most of whom are considerably younger than me. I've no idea why they want to friend me as we have little in common but there it is. I ignore all that and post very rarely on a friend's account.

Like you @Anonymous I've far better things to do and life's too short to waste my time on such nonsense. I appreciate for many it's a way of life but it's just not for me. My life is a closed, not an open, book 😊

[Anonymous]

@Glory1

The only site I maintain a profile on is LinkedIn and this is a professional profile, everyone I'm linked to on there I've either worked with, for, I've done work for or I've come to know through dealing with them on a long term basis working with them on behalf of my employer.

I know they are of excellent character and integrity and I sincerely hope they would say the same of me.

Getting back on topic though, at this stage I think Trump ought to sort the problems in his own back yard like the rampant gun violence before embarking on something like this but as he has shown repeatedly, he'll happily argue for any cause if it'll write a cheque he considers big enough.

Man of principle? I think not.

[Glory1]

@Anonymous I agree with you totally. There is plenty he should be doing like spending less time tweeting nonsense and more time doing the job he was elected to. He is probably the worst President America has had in a long time and that is saying something when you think of George W Bush.

But when you speak of gun crime the problem every President has had, if they seriously wanted to do something about it, is the strength of the gun lobby. And, unfortunately, Trump doesn't want to do anything, he's on the side of the gun lobbyists.

His latest tirade as regards Syria is also worrying as he appears to be beating his chest and trading sharp words with Russia who also have a megalomaniac at the helm. I worry where it will all end.